Author Topic: UTC Disaster  (Read 4371 times)

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NinerWupAss

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Reply #50 on: December 13, 2017, 10:05:42 am
You aren't the first to think the chanting is distasteful.  I think many think that, me included.  The issue though is we have taken complaints and ideas to the AD for years and yet the issues persist.  It's a simple reaction to not listening to the concerns of your fanbase for years combined with excessive losing. 

If our goal is AAC WE CANT dial back football.  We have to be where we are.  The A10 was never a good fit for us and we never performed there.  It's pretty simple, for us to ever be where we should be we have to get the ship righted and compete at the top of this league.  It is totally doable but our leadership has to commit to winning in football and men's basketball and to do that we have to correct things like marketing, service, winning, recruiting, etc.  To do that Judy has to either be replaced or change her approach and she has clearly stated changing her approach isn't happening.
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49r9r

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Reply #51 on: December 13, 2017, 10:11:07 am
Perhaps a "FIRE CHAPEL HILL PHIL" chant should also be used. 
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moss2k

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Reply #52 on: December 13, 2017, 10:18:03 am
Perhaps a "FIRE CHAPEL HILL PHIL" chant should also be used.
You aren't getting him out, that's wasted energy. Focus needs to be on Judy.


Mr. Bojangles

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Reply #53 on: December 13, 2017, 11:26:36 am
What's changed? Oh wait, we're recruiting to a bottom dweller league with brutal travel and no natural recruiting areas for ourselves.  Throw in recovering from the gap in recruiting that happens when a coach is sick and pushed hard to leave by boosters. Then the next one has all the prior coaches recruits leave the pipeline as often happens...

Yet most blame that 100% on the ad and coach but don't mention what drove the move and most people's support for it.
This borders on a Presidential level of self awareness. It comes off as ignorant and immature board crap that no admin will take seriously. I also find the fire Judy chants despicable.

I don't excuse the lack of fire I'm seeing from the players nor the decision to cut costs during a decline (which personally made me cut away back on my support). But you have to develop a little more nuanced view of the factors here instead of just ranting to fire persons x y z. There is no panacea to getting out of this mess. Somehow we need to get out of CUSA or the league needs to miraculously improve which seems pretty unlikely.
I doubt anyone agrees with this 😉

Does anyone have any ideas other than firing people?

You have to understand the history of how we got to where we are, and the statements made by the AD along the way.  Many of us have a much different experience with our basketball team than others.  I wouldn't say that CUSA is where any of us want to be other than the baseball team, but it was our best option when bringing on football.  Judy could have started football two decades ago and was even warned that the school was going to be booted from the original CUSA.  This included these teams:

Cincinnati
Louisville
Marquette
St. Louis
East Carolina
DePaul
Memphis
Houston
South Florida
TCU
UAB
Tulane
So. Miss.

So 6 of these teams are in the AAC, 1 in the A10, 1 in the ACC, 1 in the Big 12, 2 in the Big East, and 2 are with us in CUSA.  We were a perennial top 3 team in this league in basketball.  Now we are with and in a worse position than 2 of these teams (UAB and So. Miss.)  I believe there was only one person in charge from the time that we were in that league to where we are today.  There is no justification for that person to be around.  Upper management refuses to remove that person so you are witnessing the anger of alumni. 

As far as ideas, the biggest thing to help everyone where we are would be to blow up the G5, create regional conferences, and try to rebuild these schools this way.  We missed the boat, probably for decades to come for getting in a P5 conference.


We were the 2nd best basketball team in the years we were in C-USA 1.0.  It amazes me to see what our peers on that list of C-USA 1.0 have done since 2005.  2005 just so happens to be when Phil Dubois became chancellor.  The dynamic duo of Phil and Judy have destroyed our basketball program.  No one has been held accountable except Bobby Lutz and Alan Major.

All our fanbase wants is some hope that things will get better.  We've been waiting on that for years now.  Currently there is no light at the end of the tunnel and we're stuck with the same old BS.  Many of us were hanging on by a thread before we started football.  Starting football was great and it brought many back into the fan base, but now we are back to where we we were 10-12 years ago, only worse.


4ever niner

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Reply #54 on: December 13, 2017, 12:40:55 pm
....but, but 2 different vollyball coaches were fired since then. Also. spending for baseball has been kept under control. Phil is happy.


Dowless

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Reply #55 on: December 13, 2017, 01:18:05 pm
To be clear I'm not arguing for or against new leadership. I'm saying FireJudy Chants are distasteful to me and make me not want to attend games. It seems to mostly be kids piling on and most of them probably don't know much about it. It's just fun to fire people. I also think firing someone without having any ideas on what the new person would be tasked with doing differently is no way forward.

Some good points have been made about the mistakes the AD made and the list of schools we were associated with is pretty damning all right. I don't know why the big east boat was missed or if the administration would agree it was even possible. I also don't know why davidson can have football and A10 bball while we can't. I guess it all comes back to over reaching on what level to start the program at? Would it make sense to roll that back?

I do know we are mediocre in a bad league. Establishing a new recruiting pipeline takes quite a while when you're not a winner. But, are we missing out on kids who went to other bottom leagues or were they recruited by a top 10 league. Most kids are not going to stay home in that situation.

Dowless you said "As far as ideas, the biggest thing to help everyone where we are would be to blow up the G5, create regional conferences, and try to rebuild these schools this way.  We missed the boat, probably for decades to come for getting in a P5 conference." .
I don't understand, what is G5?

ImFromClayton you said "
My ideas:
I love what UMass has done, with basketball in a good league, and a football independent.  I think there's much more upward mobility.

I think we need a much more vibrant donor base. Whales are good, but our booster club should have much more common folk. 

We have to stick to our recruiting plan again.  Are you following that?  Our recruiting is a nightmare.

We have to stop extending coaches on knee jerk reactions following one decent season. 

These are an AD's responsibility in my view. "

I don't know what recruiting plan we're not sticking to but your post makes sense to me. If we could come up with a succinct list of ideas like this perhaps the admin would listen and provide some answers.

Sorry for my blunder as g5 and p5 are the same (Power 5 and Group of 5)  I meant everyone else in FBS besides the P5.


JaMiNNiNeR

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Reply #56 on: December 13, 2017, 01:27:51 pm
Charlotte historically seemed to always play the role of underdog giant slayer well but never successfully the role of giant. We’ve had the opportunity since 2006.


ImfromClayton

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Reply #57 on: December 13, 2017, 02:09:24 pm
I think it's worth saying that We were one of the driving forces behind the formation of CUSA 1.0, and we need to be one of the driving forces behind regionalizing these conferences.  People in the Driver's seat make decisions, others get what's left behind.  This is the 2nd worst time in our University's athletic history to rest on our laurels.  The first was when we didn't add football with USF.  We have fallen too far for complacency.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2017, 02:11:16 pm by ImfromClayton »


metro

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Reply #58 on: December 13, 2017, 04:20:25 pm
I think it's worth saying that We were one of the driving forces behind the formation of CUSA 1.0, and we need to be one of the driving forces behind regionalizing these conferences.  People in the Driver's seat make decisions, others get what's left behind.  This is the 2nd worst time in our University's athletic history to rest on our laurels.  The first was when we didn't add football with USF.  We have fallen too far for complacency.
We were not a force of any kind forming cusa 1.0   we latched on for dear life and they let us in by a thread. 


Upstate49er

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Reply #59 on: December 13, 2017, 04:32:42 pm
I think it's worth saying that We were one of the driving forces behind the formation of CUSA 1.0, and we need to be one of the driving forces behind regionalizing these conferences.  People in the Driver's seat make decisions, others get what's left behind.  This is the 2nd worst time in our University's athletic history to rest on our laurels.  The first was when we didn't add football with USF.  We have fallen too far for complacency.
We were not a force of any kind forming cusa 1.0   we latched on for dear life and they let us in by a thread.
I though it was Jeff Mullins begging that got us the invite.
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49r9r

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Reply #60 on: December 13, 2017, 06:04:14 pm
I think it's worth saying that We were one of the driving forces behind the formation of CUSA 1.0, and we need to be one of the driving forces behind regionalizing these conferences.  People in the Driver's seat make decisions, others get what's left behind.  This is the 2nd worst time in our University's athletic history to rest on our laurels.  The first was when we didn't add football with USF.  We have fallen too far for complacency.
We were not a force of any kind forming cusa 1.0   we latched on for dear life and they let us in by a thread.
I though it was Jeff Mullins begging that got us the invite.

Mullins helped, but.... Louisville needed x number of votes from Metro Conference members to allow them to leave without penalty or they needed a certain number of other teams to also leave the conference so all of the departing schools could avoid the penalty.  USF and UNCC told Louisville to take us with them or pay the penalty.  I think Tulane was involved in this too. 


« Last Edit: December 13, 2017, 06:06:47 pm by 49r9r »
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lucky57

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Reply #61 on: December 13, 2017, 06:37:48 pm
The "Fire Judy" chant....like the Airplane banner flyover,while maybe "distasteful to someone...were probably the only reason Phil came out of his bunker and faced the media (a very RARE appearance)...It is sad....but it also shows how desperate students,alums and old-time fans (since I don't think we've accumulated any "new-time" fans) have become.


If you look at the macro...the big picture...here is what is obvious...We are 4(?) years into football and have one of the,probably bottom 10 teams in the country...in a conference that is one of the worst in the country.


We NOW have probably one of the 30 WORST teams in basketball in the country.


Even if we replaced both coaches,who the heck would want to come here and coach under this regime?


As far as all our other sports...Really,who gives a crap.And it's not like we have been so fabulous in all those other men's and women's sports....It's just that almost noone cares.


JaMiNNiNeR

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Reply #62 on: December 13, 2017, 07:00:48 pm
I think it's worth saying that We were one of the driving forces behind the formation of CUSA 1.0, and we need to be one of the driving forces behind regionalizing these conferences.  People in the Driver's seat make decisions, others get what's left behind.  This is the 2nd worst time in our University's athletic history to rest on our laurels.  The first was when we didn't add football with USF.  We have fallen too far for complacency.
We were not a force of any kind forming cusa 1.0   we latched on for dear life and they let us in by a thread.
I though it was Jeff Mullins begging that got us the invite.

Mullins helped, but.... Louisville needed x number of votes from Metro Conference members to allow them to leave without penalty or they needed a certain number of other teams to also leave the conference so all of the departing schools could avoid the penalty.  USF and UNCC told Louisville to take us with them or pay the penalty.  I think Tulane was involved in this too.

That had to be a Mullins decision. I can’t imagine Judy being that  shrewd.


UnclePugsly

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Reply #63 on: December 13, 2017, 07:48:12 pm
What's changed? Oh wait, we're recruiting to a bottom dweller league with brutal travel and no natural recruiting areas for ourselves.  Throw in recovering from the gap in recruiting that happens when a coach is sick and pushed hard to leave by boosters. Then the next one has all the prior coaches recruits leave the pipeline as often happens...

Yet most blame that 100% on the ad and coach but don't mention what drove the move and most people's support for it.
This borders on a Presidential level of self awareness. It comes off as ignorant and immature board crap that no admin will take seriously. I also find the fire Judy chants despicable.

I don't excuse the lack of fire I'm seeing from the players nor the decision to cut costs during a decline (which personally made me cut away back on my support). But you have to develop a little more nuanced view of the factors here instead of just ranting to fire persons x y z. There is no panacea to getting out of this mess. Somehow we need to get out of CUSA or the league needs to miraculously improve which seems pretty unlikely.
I doubt anyone agrees with this 😉

Does anyone have any ideas other than firing people?
The few hardcore fans we have left, find the manner in which Judy has run a once good program into the ground despicable. She never earned her position, it was handed to her. Virtually every decision that she has had to make on her own has been the wrong one. She had a good foundation and a solid basketball coaching tree handed to her. Once she deviated from that tree and had to evaluate coaches for herself, we got garbage.


This program is where it is because the administration, both Judy and Phil, have no idea how to run a competitive athletic department. They want to run this s*** like the Mayberry rec league and not a D1 program with a $32 million budget.

Darn good post!


dmastinsc

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Reply #64 on: December 13, 2017, 08:08:19 pm
Maybe, just maybe, CUSA basketball won’t be considered a s*** league too much longer. Looking at real-time RPI, CUSA is ranked 14th and expected to finish 14th.

That’s a 6-8 spot jump from last year! That’s pretty damn significant, seeing CUSA was in the bottom 1/3 in all of college basketball last year. MTSU, WKU and ODU continue to improve.

I still feel hopeful that we can get a leadership change and start getting back to relevancy in college basketball. If CUSA keeps improving, I doubt we’d have many complaints if we were competing for the top spot in a 10-12 ranked conference.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2017, 08:23:12 pm by dmastinsc »


49r9r

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Reply #65 on: December 13, 2017, 09:12:50 pm
Maybe, just maybe, CUSA basketball won’t be considered a s*** league too much longer. Looking at real-time RPI, CUSA is ranked 14th and expected to finish 14th.

That’s a 6-8 spot jump from last year! That’s pretty damn significant, seeing CUSA was in the bottom 1/3 in all of college basketball last year. MTSU, WKU and ODU continue to improve.

I still feel hopeful that we can get a leadership change and start getting back to relevancy in college basketball. If CUSA keeps improving, I doubt we’d have many complaints if we were competing for the top spot in a 10-12 ranked conference.

Sadly, we are keeping CUSA from getting an even better RPI.
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Ninerfan2012

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Reply #66 on: December 13, 2017, 09:13:48 pm
Maybe, just maybe, CUSA basketball won’t be considered a s*** league too much longer. Looking at real-time RPI, CUSA is ranked 14th and expected to finish 14th.

That’s a 6-8 spot jump from last year! That’s pretty damn significant, seeing CUSA was in the bottom 1/3 in all of college basketball last year. MTSU, WKU and ODU continue to improve.

I still feel hopeful that we can get a leadership change and start getting back to relevancy in college basketball. If CUSA keeps improving, I doubt we’d have many complaints if we were competing for the top spot in a 10-12 ranked conference.

Sadly, we are keeping CUSA from getting an even better RPI.

Remember when we bitched about the sub 300 rpi schools...well guess what we've become!!!


dmastinsc

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Reply #67 on: December 13, 2017, 09:35:51 pm
Maybe, just maybe, CUSA basketball won’t be considered a s*** league too much longer. Looking at real-time RPI, CUSA is ranked 14th and expected to finish 14th.

That’s a 6-8 spot jump from last year! That’s pretty damn significant, seeing CUSA was in the bottom 1/3 in all of college basketball last year. MTSU, WKU and ODU continue to improve.

I still feel hopeful that we can get a leadership change and start getting back to relevancy in college basketball. If CUSA keeps improving, I doubt we’d have many complaints if we were competing for the top spot in a 10-12 ranked conference.

Sadly, we are keeping CUSA from getting an even better RPI.

Remember when we bitched about the sub 300 rpi schools...well guess what we've become!!!

Right! CUSA only has two 300+ RPI teams this season (with us being one of them). Silver lining, none the less.


 

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